Author Topic: Different gear boxes  (Read 21076 times)

Offline Yoof

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Re: Different gear boxes
« Reply #30 on: May 08, 2012, 04:30:35 pm »
I think Peter Newman (yellow mk1/mk2 G60?) uses a Klaus box- and obviously uses aftermarket management.

I'd have thought he's making 250Nm+, but I don't know how often he rebuilds boxes.

From my spreadsheet I made for a WL Motorsport box for sale, here's some typical 'Berg' ratios, control tyre is 540mm diameter (175/60 R13)

G40   ATV               
   Final Drive:   3.333   Tyre Diameter (mm)   540.2      Actual Speed:
      Gear Ratio   Engine Revs(rpm)   Output shaft(rpm)   Driveshaft(rpm)   mph
   1st   3.455   6800   1968   591   37.36
   2nd   2.095   7000   3341   1002   63.43
   3rd   1.469   7000   4765   1430   90.46
   4th   1.098   7000   6375   1913   121.02
   5th   0.851   7000   8226   2468   156.15
   5th   0.851   3000   3525   1058   66.92
                  
                  
                  
WL Motorsport   ATV               
   Final Drive:   4.710   Tyre Diameter (mm)   540.2      Actual Speed:
      Gear Ratio   Engine Revs(rpm)   Output shaft(rpm)   Driveshaft(rpm)   mph
   1st   2.500   7000   2800   594   37.61
   2nd   1.880   7000   3723   791   50.02
   3rd   1.520   7000   4605   978   61.86
   4th   1.290   7000   5426   1152   72.89
   5th   1.160   7000   6034   1281   81.06
   5th   1.160   3000   2586   549   34.74

That's pasted a little squiffy, but last column is speed in gear @ 7000rpm, 81mph in 5th for the WL box!!!

Part of th reason there's nothing that good for G40s, is the Berg Cup boys can make do with stock(ish) boxes, they've got minimal torque from the screamer n/a motors


Offline Justin14100

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Re: Different gear boxes
« Reply #32 on: May 08, 2012, 04:39:04 pm »
I think getting an adapter plate for a Lupo GTi box would be a good way to go as you get a 6 speed box, I had discussions about making one with the Wizard (father) who used to make several a month when he was an engineer while travelling as a much younger man.

Offline djtez

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Re: Different gear boxes
« Reply #33 on: May 08, 2012, 04:47:31 pm »
There are discussions of needing the Salzmann subframe (similar to stage 3 ppp)
and make a bracket from that to steady the box..

i have no idea about a shifter yet..

so much german ahhhh

Offline Yoof

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Re: Different gear boxes
« Reply #34 on: May 08, 2012, 05:32:12 pm »
I think getting an adapter plate for a Lupo GTi box would be a good way to go as you get a 6 speed box, I had discussions about making one with the Wizard (father) who used to make several a month when he was an engineer while travelling as a much younger man.

Don't think the extra gear gains you anything due to the ratios, also not sure how strong those boxes are?


Offline jez1272gt

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Re: Different gear boxes
« Reply #35 on: August 20, 2012, 11:06:29 am »
I am really interested in this topic. I have been looking into stronger boxes and have concluded that im not rich enough to go with a s1600 gemini sequential job and from a driving prospective i think i would rather have a traditional manual anyway.

Yoof you mention that you have tried to contact Klaus, any joy with that out of interest? Also do you fancy sharing the table of 02a ratios you speak of?

I would like to look further into the 085/02a bell housing/cog box option, in my mind it seems to be the best road to go down. Has anyone got the any further info on what the conversion consists of what sort of money the converion plate is? I tried looking through the german polo forum that has been linked to but it doesnt make much sense to me (lack of patience) and my german is non exsistant.... ::)

Offline Yoof

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Re: Different gear boxes
« Reply #36 on: August 20, 2012, 11:41:30 am »
Yeah no worries, I found it through Google (020 ratios or something), ping me your e-mail and I'll send it over.

Regarding the conversion, the actual mounting of the box requires an adapter plate and I'd guess some plate for a Polo starter motor.

Gearlinkage & associated cabling/shifter to be mounted

Driveshafts to be made (£££)

LSD to be purchased

Chassis to be cut

Subframe to be modified

Speedo drive (presume this is the same)

Hydro clutch potential (requires new pedal box) need to check clutch input shaft on box/flywheel

New gearbox mounts to chassis

The conversion plate is probably the cheap bit, I can't see it happening for <£2k which buys you alot of 085 boxes! I've done my sums and gone against it, makes more sense to put a 20v in it from the outset.

Klaus never responded, I've seen the boxes (second hand) go for £4-5k on Berg Cup Marketplace - at which point, I'm out!


Offline jez1272gt

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Re: Different gear boxes
« Reply #37 on: August 20, 2012, 12:15:58 pm »
My email is futureclip@yahoo.co.uk - cheers mate.

Yeah i realise the costs/work involved wont be cheap but i dont really want an unreliablecar due to the box, I would rather spend the money now whilst its still in bits than keep shafting boxes and having to strip them repeatedly. Plus if it stands a chance of ruining an expensive track day....!!!

I'm toying with the idea at the moment as im going wide track and need to get shafts made anyway, can adapt my cable obp pedal box to hydro easily, sell the polo quaife diff and cae mech tower i have and use the money towards the new bits. Not bothered about chasis cutting and fabrication of mounts etc as my mates love it when i tell them i have more work on the shit polo again :D

As for sequential, I cant justify spending another £4-5k on the bloody thing plus stand alone management etc, it already owes me a good deposit on a house so its 02a or no way really.

Offline Yoof

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Re: Different gear boxes
« Reply #38 on: August 20, 2012, 12:48:59 pm »
I agree!

Having said that, I've taken the piss with my old box for quite a while (drag slicks, 200bhp+ for a long time) and it was 2nd that finally let go at Oulton.

Wide track? What components you using for that?

Offline jez1272gt

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Re: Different gear boxes
« Reply #39 on: August 20, 2012, 01:15:51 pm »
We shall see what happens. Might see how long the first box lasts and go from there. I've thought about cryo freezing the full gearset as well.

Wide track will be ground control castor/camber top mounts, custom arms, bones and shafts and fibre glass haug kit which I've had sitting in my garage for 4odd years (if I can find it all lol) and some other bits thrown in.

Offline Yoof

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Re: Different gear boxes
« Reply #40 on: August 20, 2012, 04:30:46 pm »
How wide is the Haug stuff? Only reason I ask is I wouldn't/couldn't go much wider with mine on the Berg arches (WL ones) with 7" wheels and ET0 offset as it would contact, unless the Haug stuff has much more room?

Should look sweet!

Offline jez1272gt

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Re: Different gear boxes
« Reply #41 on: August 20, 2012, 10:28:25 pm »
I'm pretty sure that on the crappy wheels that are on there at the moment (et33 7") i have about 2" gap to fill per side. Thats all fun that i have to come. I havent thought much about offsets yet, as i havent looked into wheels too much. Do you notice any real difference in handling with such a low offset? (sorry off topic) Should be ok when its done, its taken long enough (to be fair i'll probably get bored of it in 2 months again and not touch it for the follwoing 18 months)

Offline Yoof

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Re: Different gear boxes
« Reply #42 on: August 21, 2012, 07:57:39 am »
Probably 1" or so wider than the WL stuff then  :o

Regarding handling, it's not really fair as I'd gone from different tyre sizes (and type) between 14" ET38 185/55 K700 cut slicks, to a 13" 540mm full slick on an ET0 rim.

In theory yes should reduce roll too.


Offline vee-dub90

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Re: Different gear boxes
« Reply #44 on: June 07, 2013, 04:27:14 pm »
Interesting, would someone like quaife be willing to make gearsets?