Author Topic: H&R Coilovers / H&R cup kit, help me decide  (Read 5744 times)

Offline GSBellew

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H&R Coilovers / H&R cup kit, help me decide
« on: September 29, 2008, 01:41:25 am »
I've to decide pretty quickly which suspension I am putting in my G40 before putting it back together.

Till the end of September I can get a 10% discount from my supplier of H&R suspension leaving the prices as follows:

H&R Cup Kit € 402.30 (£318.45)

H&R Coilovers € 1055 (£835.12)

So I'm looking at those two options at the minute, the current set up is a koni & eibach combo, but its getting on 8 years old so needs to go, I would like slightly lower than it is now as I think its still too high, having coilovers on my daily driver Corrado has gotten me used to the adjustably of them which is why I am thinking of going that route with the G40.

Has anyone here any experience of the H&R coilovers?

Or any coilovers on G40's, are they worth the extra over a spring and shock combo?

Any other suggestions for suspension set ups are welcome too!

Offline breadman

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Re: H&R Coilovers / H&R cup kit, help me decide
« Reply #1 on: October 01, 2008, 10:38:17 pm »
The H&R cup kit is regarded as an excellent setup. The ride is pretty firm, yet remains compliant enough to allow the suspension to still work as it should. It can be bought for under £300 and has to be one of the best non adjustable damper road setups available. It lowers the front 60mm and the rear 40 or 60mm via a spacer.

The H&R coilover kit is undoubtably an excellent setup as well. I have no experience of it, but expect it would perform superbly.

However IMO, unless you really need the adjustability of coilovers for ultimately fine tuning the suspension (corner weighting etc) for track use and so on they really are a very expensive luxury indeed - over twice the money of the normal spring/damper kits. Personally, I'd far sooner spend the extra money on new bushes and a subframe/wishbone kit. The latter apparently make a massive improvement, not only in cornering abilities but also in traction, braking and the bodyshell stiffness.

By far the majority of people only buy coilovers so they can lower their car right down. Cheap coilovers aren't available for the mk1 -3 Polo due to its integral strut/hub housing design. Other cars can be fitted with cheap coilover kits and the majority of them are fitted so the car can be "slammed". These might look good, but thats about all. It doesn't matter how good the dampers and springs are in the coilover kit, if the suspension/steering/driveshaft geometry is working beyond its ideal design parameters then it won't improve the handling and roadholding of the car.

There is also the issue of maintenance on coilovers. I'd hope due to the cost of them, the H&R kits have plated threads to prevent corrosion? Road dirt and corrosion can lead to seized spring seats so they need to be kept clean.

So to sum it up, if you have a standard or even a very quick uprated G40 that might see a bit of track action with excellent handling/roadholding being important, then the cup kit is ideal.
If you're doing virtually all track day stuff and ultimate adjustability is important for setting the car up at different tracks and so on, then spend the money and go for the coilovers.

Hope this helps.
Richard.

Offline G-spot

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Re: H&R Coilovers / H&R cup kit, help me decide
« Reply #2 on: October 02, 2008, 07:09:46 pm »
Nice one Breadman, thats a really good read, and as I'm also in the market for a better spring/damper combo the the cup kit comes nicely into budget and specification.  I'm one of the lucky guys to soon be recieving my wishbone/subframe conversion care of PPP, so as my car is a daily driver and not really looking to do any serious track work then I think the decission is made!!

Currently running -40/40mm Eibachs on new OEM shocks which I find complient enough, but I fear they may be overworked when I hook up the better geometery once the frame arrives. 

Next question;  Where is the best place to get a sub £300 cup kit from??

Offline breadman

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Re: H&R Coilovers / H&R cup kit, help me decide
« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2008, 08:33:44 pm »
Mmm, looks like I mislead you there. I'm sure the last time I looked, Jackson Tuning on Club Polo was selling them for around £280. However I've just checked and they're now £360! :o
Still worthwhile IMO.
« Last Edit: October 02, 2008, 08:36:05 pm by breadman »

Offline GSBellew

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Re: H&R Coilovers / H&R cup kit, help me decide
« Reply #4 on: October 03, 2008, 01:58:01 pm »
Very interesting and informative reply, thank you  :)

I am still torn on the issue though.

The reason I am leaning towards coilovers is to set the ride height just exactly as I want it, its too high at the front in my opinion on the current koni & eibach setup, but then I am concerned that the 60mm the H&R cup kit drops it may be just too low in the end  ???

The wheels I have on at the minute are 15" BBS RM's if I end up too low chances are I'll have rubbing issues.

Its purely a weekend car and will see very little day to day use, when its finished its likely to be summer use only so the coilovers seizing should not be a problem as they are never going to get dirty  :D

It is an awfull lot of extra money, but on the other hand its cheaper to do it right once rather than having to do it twice?

I've been having this debate with myself for nearly a year now trying to decide  :o :-[

Offline G-spot

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Re: H&R Coilovers / H&R cup kit, help me decide
« Reply #5 on: October 03, 2008, 08:21:19 pm »
Well if there the same Eibach springs I got then my phase one tweek will be 10mm lowering caps, before I go down the route of a full 60mm drop.  If your in no rush I'll let you know when I get around to it(it may be a while though), I'm running 14's so I'm not expecting any rubbing issues.

Offline breadman

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Re: H&R Coilovers / H&R cup kit, help me decide
« Reply #6 on: October 03, 2008, 11:34:56 pm »
Very interesting and informative reply, thank you  :)

I am still torn on the issue though.

The reason I am leaning towards coilovers is to set the ride height just exactly as I want it, its too high at the front in my opinion on the current koni & eibach setup, but then I am concerned that the 60mm the H&R cup kit drops it may be just too low in the end  ???

The wheels I have on at the minute are 15" BBS RM's if I end up too low chances are I'll have rubbing issues.

Its purely a weekend car and will see very little day to day use, when its finished its likely to be summer use only so the coilovers seizing should not be a problem as they are never going to get dirty  :D

It is an awfull lot of extra money, but on the other hand its cheaper to do it right once rather than having to do it twice?

I've been having this debate with myself for nearly a year now trying to decide  :o :-[

Yeah 15" wheels on G40's can be a problem. Trying to find tyres that are wide enough with a low enough profile to keep the rolling radius very near standard is almost impossible. TBH, 13" or 14" wheels are far better suited to the G40 with regards to tyre choice and fitment.
I still reckon the Cup kit would be the best option. The rear can be set at either 60 or 40mm down, so you have a choice there. Its only the front you may have a clearance issue with, the arch liners are often the first part a tyre will rub on so these can easily be removed. However, unless your tyres are vastly different in R.R. you should be absolutely fine.
Remember, its only the adjustability that you are paying all the extra money for. The springs are still just springs and the dampers still dampers. If you set it up initially so your happy with the ride height and looks of the car, will you ever use the adjustment again? Summer use or not, they will get dirty!
If you wanted to get the best out of your G40 and were a regular at different track days and events then it would make them a far more worthwhile purchase.
A subframe/wishbone setup and H&R Cup kit with all new poly bushes would make a superb setup for similar money to just the coilovers on their own but with everything else left standard. I know how I'd sooner spend £800!
I'm not against coilovers at all, its just it's a huge amount of money to spend in relation to the value of the car if its only the ride height you're worried about.
Good luck which ever you choose.
Richard.

Offline G-spot

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Re: H&R Coilovers / H&R cup kit, help me decide
« Reply #7 on: October 04, 2008, 01:10:34 pm »
If anyone is looking for the above kits, then there are several on European ebay, and interestingly I noticed a few different ride hieght combinations for both the G40's and other 86c type set-ups. Worth a look if your happy buying from our German ebay friends.

Offline G-spot

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Re: H&R Coilovers / H&R cup kit, help me decide
« Reply #8 on: October 05, 2008, 03:07:29 pm »
Just to add to the above post, I now realise that the different kits are the sport kits and the comfort kits, anyone got any info on the comfort kits as so far I think we've been discussing the sport kits.

Offline Varley

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Re: H&R Coilovers / H&R cup kit, help me decide
« Reply #9 on: October 07, 2008, 12:36:52 pm »
I couldn't agree more with the breadman, cup kit is ideal for the road unless you absolutely need the adjustment, which I personally don't feel I do if you take out the rubbing issue.

I've found my cup kit to be ideally suited to road driving, firm but not excessively so, and my subframe/wishbone setup and it's easily the best £500 odd I've ever spent on the G without a shadow of a doubt, definately a killer handling combo.

I'm also running 15" wheels (ATS cups) and they don't rub any more, although it did take a few stabs at the arches to clear everything properly. I agree that 14's are strictly speaking a better choice for ultimate handling but presumably like yourself I just love the look!

I reckon the bbs's should cause you far fewer problems at cup kit ride height than I had as they should be the correct offset which mine are not.

Hope this helps.