Club G40 Forum
Club G40 => General Car Chat => Topic started by: juan on December 10, 2008, 06:32:58 pm
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As above im thinking of doing a small batch of Eaton kits depending on interest.
The kit would basically be the same as the psd kit but the pulley arrangement would be changed so that the charger pulley would be easily changeable (i.e bigger or smaller) also the bracket may be slightly thicker (to keep down machining costs).
Its just a rough idea at the moment as im currently gathering info as to how much it will cost and building up my part made kit.
The changeble pulley arrangement that im currently planning would mean you could run anywhere from say standard g40 boost all the way up to the eatons maximum and various stages inbetween.
Depending on price do you guys think there would be much interest in a small batch of psd eaton kit's.
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Id be intrested, any idea of how much they would cost?
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Pm with you...
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Id be intrested, any idea of how much they would cost?
not sure how much they would cost yet as im still need to talk to a couple of people about various things but they should be cheaper than the psd kit as i dont have lots of overhead costs.
I will update as i know more :), i was just putting this up to gauge interest.
Hopefully i should have a pretty firm price over christmas as ill have more time to work on it while im off uni.
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Here's some pics of what the kit the PSD eaton kit looks like.
What i may be producing will be the same but with the pulley be changeable and the plate may be thicker.
Here's some pics of the psd eaton kit:
(http://www.pitstopdevelopments.co.uk/eaton/DSCF2214_resize.jpg)
(http://www.pitstopdevelopments.co.uk/eaton/DSCF2216_resize.jpg)
(http://www.pitstopdevelopments.co.uk/eaton/DSCF2216_resize.jpg)
(http://www.pitstopdevelopments.co.uk/eaton/DSCF2218_resize.jpg)
(http://www.pitstopdevelopments.co.uk/eaton/DSCF2219_resize.jpg)
(http://www.pitstopdevelopments.co.uk/eaton/DSCF2221_resize.jpg)
(http://www.pitstopdevelopments.co.uk/eaton/DSCF2223_resize.jpg)
(http://www.pitstopdevelopments.co.uk/eaton/DSCF2224_resize.jpg)
(http://www.pitstopdevelopments.co.uk/eaton/DSCF2225_resize.jpg)
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Will this kit come with all the necessary fixtures and fitting?
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i would be very very interested in a set of toothed pullys for the eaton with a 19 percent smaller charger pully. let me know if you can help at all
steven
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i would be very very interested in a set of toothed pullys for the eaton with a 19 percent smaller charger pully. let me know if you can help at all
steven
I may be able to help, but the changeable toothed system that im designing for the eaton is meant to be used in conjunction with the psd style nose cone blankng plate/mounting bracket.
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Will this kit come with all the necessary fixtures and fitting?
Yes it would, although i can't give a definite specification at the moment but im going to make the kit as comprehensive as possible.
Im also thinking of including toothed crank and alternator pulleys as part of the kit.
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i would be very very interested in a set of toothed pullys for the eaton with a 19 percent smaller charger pully. let me know if you can help at all
steven
I may be able to help, but the changeable toothed system that im designing for the eaton is meant to be used in conjunction with the psd style nose cone blankng plate/mounting bracket.
ohhh poo so does that mean i could not use the charger pully on a non psd modified charger ?
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nope it wouldn't work.
There may be toothed pulleys avalible for the standard eaton charger although im not sure?
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ok thanks for the help anyway
steven
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hey mate i would be intrested in buy a psd eaton kit ( i could do with one now lol) but when you get some made give me a shout i would be very intrested ;D
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hey mate i would be intrested in buy a psd eaton kit ( i could do with one now lol) but when you get some made give me a shout i would be very intrested ;D
cool i will update when i have more info,
i should have a definate price for the kit some time over the christmas holidays, so once ive sorted out how much its going to cost and whats included etc i will be running a group buy.
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Am very interested in this. Looking forward to more info/price.
Rob
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would be very interested in this around late jan-early feb
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Hi,
Fair play for taking on the eaton kit challenge - very interested.
Never had a chance to scout round a PSD kit so unsure of how it works, Would the outlet from the charger be in the same place as a G lader? i.e could I still use my PSD front mount kit?
Also, would it essentially be compatible with the PSD toothed belt kits? By that I mean could I keep the crank and alternator pulleys and use your (hopefully interchangable) charger pulley? Would it require some kind of belt tensioner?
Last but not least, I'm trying to weigh up the pro's/cons of going eaton over a K03 turbo setup and was wondering what's swung it in favour of the eaton for you? Noise? Power delivery?
Cheers mate - good luck with the project.
Varley.
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Hi,
Fair play for taking on the eaton kit challenge - very interested.
Never had a chance to scout round a PSD kit so unsure of how it works, Would the outlet from the charger be in the same place as a G lader? i.e could I still use my PSD front mount kit?
Also, would it essentially be compatible with the PSD toothed belt kits? By that I mean could I keep the crank and alternator pulleys and use your (hopefully interchangable) charger pulley? Would it require some kind of belt tensioner?
Last but not least, I'm trying to weigh up the pro's/cons of going eaton over a K03 turbo setup and was wondering what's swung it in favour of the eaton for you? Noise? Power delivery?
Cheers mate - good luck with the project.
Varley.
Should work fine in conjunction with the psd front mount :) And yep it will work fine with the psd toothed crank and alternator pulleys, you won't need any extra belt tensioner as the psd eaton kit incorparates a belt tensioner and a micro tensioner to stop belt bounce.
As for pro's and cons, the eaton is a sealed unit with a life expectancy of well over 100k miles, the power delivery is nice and linear and yep they can be very noisy but they can also be silenced.
Reason i chose eaton is i wanted a charger that im not going to have to be worrying about it blowing up and i didn't want to have more oil lines cluttering up the engine bay.
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Here's some rolling roads graphs, one of an slightly tuned eaton G40 and one of a Tuned G40.
Here's the spec's of lreg's old eaton setup
induction> Large induction K&N cone air filter, port matched GT inlet manifold, 51mm throttle body.
Type of forced induction> Eaton
Intercooler> AW tracksport
Pulley> Toothed pulley kit
Cylindor head> Standard
Camshaft> Standard
Exhaust Manifold> Standard
Exhaust system> Stock decat downpipe and 63mm bastuck system, single silencer
Fuelling> Stock ECU, green injectors and a PSD remap with an sns stage V base code
Headgasket> Standard
Pistons> Standard cast 1272cc
Rods> standard
Crank> Standard
Flywheel> Lightened
189bhp and 162lb/ft of torque which was not bad considering the amount of standard parts still on the car
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v499/royalblue8vgti/RRPLOT.jpg)
And here's the spec of a g40 engine:
nduction> Jetex cone filter, Jabba cold air box, dewedged TB, standard intercooler + chargecooler, GT inlet manifold
Type of forced induction> G40 R1
Pulley> 65mm toothies
Cylindor head> Standard
Camshaft> standard
Exhaust Manifold> 4 branch PSD
Exhaust system> 63mm bastuck, twin silencer
Fuelling> PSD chip not a custom map, standard injectors
Headgasket> Standard
Pistons> Standard cast 1272cc
Rods> standard
Crank> Standard
Flywheel> Standard
(http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b329/adeg40/RRpolo161002.jpg)
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Yep, I'm pretty much sold mate.
Will be an absolute monster when hooked up to my 1.5!
Keep me posted on progress and have a good Christmas.
Cheers,
Varley.
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Here's some rolling roads graphs, one of an slightly tuned eaton G40 and one of a Tuned G40.
Here's the spec's of lreg's old eaton setup
induction> Large induction K&N cone air filter, port matched GT inlet manifold, 51mm throttle body.
Type of forced induction> Eaton
Intercooler> AW tracksport
Pulley> Toothed pulley kit
Cylindor head> Standard
Camshaft> Standard
Exhaust Manifold> Standard
Exhaust system> Stock decat downpipe and 63mm bastuck system, single silencer
Fuelling> Stock ECU, green injectors and a PSD remap with an sns stage V base code
Headgasket> Standard
Pistons> Standard cast 1272cc
Rods> standard
Crank> Standard
Flywheel> Lightened
That set-up sounds familiar! ;)
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Would be interesting to see an AF plot of the G40 run. You can see the injectors going static by the dip in the curves around 5K. Thing is, does the power tail off due to wrong AF or flow of the head.......
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cool i will update when i have more info,
i should have a definate price for the kit some time over the christmas holidays, so once ive sorted out how much its going to cost and whats included etc i will be running a group buy.
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howz the eaton kit project doing have you got any price lists yet ?
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I should have a price pretty soon, im going to see about aqua cutting tommorow :)
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cool mate keep in touch with the progress
on questian is your kit gonna have the toothed pulleys like the psd one ?
and it is just the kit not the charger and kit altogether ?
thanks
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cool mate keep in touch with the progress
on questian is your kit gonna have the toothed pulleys like the psd one ?
and it is just the kit not the charger and kit altogether ?
thanks
My kit will be the same as the psd kit except i will also include the appropriate toothed pulleys for the crank and alternator.
And nope the price won't include a eaton charger although i don't mind sourcing one for you if needs be, although they're easy enough to pick up on ebay.
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yeh i have a eaton charger im just waiting on kit keep me updated ;D
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Little update, just doing some revised Auto Cad drawings of the plate at the moment :)
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kool
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Sounds like things are ticking along nicely Juan?
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Sounds like things are ticking along nicely Juan?
Yeah ive made a fair bit of progress but there's quite alot more to it than is apparent, it will probably take a bit longer than expected but i want to get the kit spot on :)
I would update in more detail but i don't think anyone wants to hear about radius this, intersection that, tolerances, etc etc
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I am listening ;D (not that i will understand it all but crack on)
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lol ok if you really want to know, the parts that make up the psd toothed pulley were a bit of a mix up ie the oil seal is metric standard size and the bearing imperial standard size but im going to change this so it is all done using one standard.
But i did get the raduis's on the plate near enough spot on from my intial drawing :)
Also i hate windows vista as it likes fucking up auto cad :(
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nice to know this is still happening keep us all updated
steven
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good work matey. Good to see a kit once they're done. Mine should be on shortly ;-)
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all his hard work will be paying of soon look how much ppl are intrested in the kit
once finished hes gonna be a millionair lol ;D ;D
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Sure will considering how much PSD kits change hands for these days!
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Jaun I am yet to work out how the PSD kit chews belts but it would be nice if you could rectify the problems.
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Jaun I am yet to work out how the PSD kit chews belts but it would be nice if you could rectify the problems.
Yeah that is a bit of a concern and its one of the reasons im going to take a bit longer developing these to get them right.
Ive got an idea for making the support brace/bar do its job better.
Ive got to look at vibration of the pulley as if its taking 30bhp to spin the eaton and the pulley is rotating pretty damn fast then the pulley needs to be machined really spot on and needs to be really acurately lined up. I did enquire about aqua cutting for the pulleys but it leaves lots of small abbrasive particles embeded in the surface layer which would be a no no for the belts.
I think the basic design is a good'un it just needs refining (increase stability, cut down on vibrations bothing concerning the mounting hardware and the moving parts, the pulleys needs to be as accurate as possible (steve used a broaching tool to create his but im currently looking into pulley stock)
Any more Q's or suggestions fire away :)
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I'm not sure quite yet about the mounting of the charger but couldn't little rubber washers or something along those lines be used to cut down on vibration on the charger?
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I'm not sure quite yet about the mounting of the charger but couldn't little rubber washers or something along those lines be used to cut down on vibration on the charger?
You have 2 issues with the eaton.
1) its attached to the engine and therefore rocks
2) It just 'hangs' in place and there is nothing to brace it.
Rubber washers will just flex too much and make it unstable
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I'm not sure quite yet about the mounting of the charger but couldn't little rubber washers or something along those lines be used to cut down on vibration on the charger?
You have 2 issues with the eaton.
1) its attached to the engine and therefore rocks
2) It just 'hangs' in place and there is nothing to brace it.
Rubber washers will just flex too much and make it unstable
I hear what your saying giorgio, can't have rubber washers as they'd allow even more movement of the eaton.
Well what im thinking is to use other bit of the engine mount which is located where the eatons water pump used to be and on to this mount place some type of rubber bung and clamp, with this area not be a mounting point for the charger it could be used to take away some of the vibrations and at the same time adding a small amount of stability ;)
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Update :)
Ive had a couple of people messaging me lately asking for spec and price and i have replied to them with a rough spec and price which is by no means final.
Anyway i thought id post up the rough spec and price for everyone to see :) but can everyone bear in mind that this spec and price is not final its just an estimation.
im hoping to do the kit for around £650.
This would include:
#Crank and alternator pulleys
#Appropriate htd toothed belt
#Stainless steel fitting brackets
# All necesary bearings and oil seals
# Machined micro belt tensioner
#Main belt tensioner
# 2 custom htd charger pulleys (1 1bar and another the original psd spec(230bhp+) )
#PSD ecu chip
#Bracing brackets/bar
#Air filter + adaption kit for the eaton outlet.
#Radiator lowering bar.
(i may have missed something out as ive just put this list down off the top of my head )
Please please please bear in mind this price is only an estimation and also the specification is not final as ive got alot of work/reasearch/price gathering to do on the kit before its ready.
The price could be a bit more than what ive said there but it also could be a bit less but i can't say for definate until i have a final specification and know exactly how much everything is going to cost to get put together and get machined etc.
Opinions welcome and constructive criticism are allways welcome.
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I'm interested but it has to be simple and reliable.
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I'm interested but it has to be simple and reliable.
Its pretty simple to be honest, here's some pics of Giorgio's eaton kit on his car:
(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j188/GiorgioGenesis/280720081195.jpg)
(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j188/GiorgioGenesis/280720081194.jpg)
As for reliability the eaton charger is a sealed unit with a service life of 100k+ miles :)
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I presume he meant reliability of the mounting parts you are making rather than the charger. Be good if it's made to the spec the psd kit was.
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I presume he meant reliability of the mounting parts you are making rather than the charger. Be good if it's made to the spec the psd kit was.
Ahh yeah, well its being made to Psd spec and the plate itself may actually be slightly thicker depending on what thickness stainless is used and how much has to skimmed for the gasket face, also im redisigning the bracing bar/bracket with an extra mounting point and a revised structure. To put it simply everything is being made to the psd spec if not better.
Also i got hold of a cheap g40 before christmas which i will be using as a guinea pig to trial/test the kits before i sell them to anyone.
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Well I can definately vouch for the reliabilty of the chargers as having worked in a BM main dealer since they came about and have never changed one. If it passes quality checks i'm even more interested.
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how is the kit cumming on i cant wait to get one
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how is the kit cumming on i cant wait to get on
Progress has slowed down a bit lately as im in the middle of a load of exams :(
But once ive done my physics exam then im going to get onto drawing up the two part pulley in autocad :)
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cool good luck with your exams hope you pass and also gd luck on the drawings ;D ;D
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I second that! good luck mate :)
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how did the exams go ? did you do good ?
and how is the eaton kit project going ?
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Any news about how this is coming along (assuming it still it)?
As the G-Charger on my G40 is starting to get noisy and will need a rebuild soon. However i do have a spare Eaton M45 lying around doing nothing that i'm very interested about fitting instead.
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Updates will be coming soon ;)
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Proper updates will be coming in the next few weeks (design tweeks and features), but thought i'd add that the kit will now be coming with either a 24 tooth pulley (200bhp+) or a 27 tooth pulley (160/170bhp 'ish).
The reason for the kit only coming with one pulley is down to price as people that only want one pulley don't want to have to be paying for two different pulleys.
If you are intersted in having two pulleys the second pulley will be avalible but it will be an extra cost.
I think this is a fair way of doing it, what does everyone think?
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i'll count the teeth on my charger again. Want the best bhp i can ;-)
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Sounds good to me as i think i'd be a little worried about putting my foot down with 200+Bhp about to shred my gearbox and the 160/170ish sounds about perfect for me :)
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i would have 1 of 27 tooth pulleys first bt that 30-40ish bhp might be too good to resist lol
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27 tooth pulley would be the wise idea if your on standard pistons etc.
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dont think standard internals would last long with that much power!!!!
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dont think standard internals would last long with that much power!!!!
The 27 tooth pulley is roughly 1 bar or so of boost, which a healthy g40 engine should handle shoudlnt it?
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i might be in line for one of the 24 tooth ones i,ll have to coulnt the teeth on mine as im not sure how many it has but either way i will want a pully as mine is really worn.
steven
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dont think standard internals would last long with that much power!!!!
What other internals would you suggest ?
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just been and counted the teeth on my pully and i have 24 lol i thought it was rapid i think im gonna have to get forged pistons before i melt my standard ones.
steven
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hi mate just wanna no how the kit was comming along do you rekon you will get some made by the summer time
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hi mate just wanna no how the kit was comming along do you rekon you will get some made by the summer time
Yep it should be done by the summer time :)
sorry for the slow progress but uni has had to take priority lately, a big update will be coming soon though :)